2013 NFL Week 7

[Gunpowder]

They punted up a storm last night.

[SportsDoc]

Could the Vikings get Ryan Leaf out of prison in time for this week's game?

[Rush2112]

How much worse can the Bucs get? We're about to find out.

Doug Martin out for the year.

Not quite. Team not ruling out return.

[Scottie]

Christian Ponder wins this game for Minnesota.

Believe it. I treated that with kid-gloves upthread but, yeah, gotta think that. NYG avoids 0-7 only because a team managed to play worse than them.

Just now on Twitter:

Josh Freeman had 16 overthrown passes last night. Peyton Manning has 16 overthrown passes THIS SEASON

Comparison is, of course, a deadly nasty game because one can cherry-pick the apples and the oranges. One can say, in baseball, some guy struck out 200 times whereas some other guy on a better team only struck out 38 times and hoist it up as a hey well look at this. Yet that ESPN citing does underscore just how agonizingly awful Freeman was to witness. Completely over his head. That game was a damning indictment of both teams. To put it kindly, they'll both have single-digit first round draft picks next summer. 4-12, 3-13, not out of the question for either.

That game was a terrible instance of "you're going to get a win only because both teams cannot mathematically lose the same game".

[kranepool]

How much worse can the Bucs get? We're about to find out.

Doug Martin out for the year.

Not quite. Team not ruling out return.

Yeah, they appended the question mark after I posted that link.

Still, if you have a 2-12 team, are you really going to bring him back for weeks 16 and 17? Besides, the only person not writing him off is Schiano.

[Gunpowder]

The only reason I can't say Ponder wins that game is because I don't think it's responsible to assume that Ponder wins anything.

[Rush2112]

I'm not sure what Cassel did (besides actually win) that he's not in the discussion.

It's absolutely asinine to think a guy that's been on your team for 10 days or whatever is going to know enough to run an NFL offense. It's also quite stupid to trot a guy out there that is down in the dumps after the happenings with his last team.

Why not start Cassel for a week or two until Freeman is more comfortable and then see what ya got.

Browns/Rams should trade for Cassel, he'll come cheap, has a short contract, and is an ok QB.


ETA: or the Rams could go with another former Chief and sign Brady Quinn.

[Scottie]

The only reason I can't say Ponder wins that game is because I don't think it's responsible to assume that Ponder wins anything.

He does have a razor thin better winning percentage than Josh Freeman. But . . . fair enough.

[Gunpowder]

I'm not sure what Cassel did (besides actually win) that he's not in the discussion.

It's absolutely asinine to think a guy that's been on your team for 10 days or whatever is going to know enough to run an NFL offense. It's also quite stupid to trot a guy out there that is down in the dumps after the happenings with his last team.

Why not start Cassel for a week or two until Freeman is more comfortable and then see what ya got.

Browns/Rams should trade for Cassel, he'll come cheap, has a short contract, and is an ok QB.


ETA: or the Rams could go with another former Chief and sign Brady Quinn.

Cassel got blown out 38-10 last week. His just win energy was low.

[Gunpowder]

The only reason I can't say Ponder wins that game is because I don't think it's responsible to assume that Ponder wins anything.

He does have a razor thin better winning percentage than Josh Freeman. But . . . fair enough.

Well, ridiculous Adrian Peterson and Percy Harvin existed for a good portion of that.

The only reason Freeman is there was Ponder's habit of not winning completely winnable games. Look at some of these performances - http://www.pro-football-reference.com/p ... elog/2012/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - and wow...they actually won two of the three of the games where he threw for less than 100 yards (!).

If Freeman doesn't become good again, they'll have to draft somebody in the first this offseason.

[Scottie]

Peterson had 13 carries for 28 yards. It's safe to say that they were not using him right, the line play was horrific, and the play calling was dismal. Freeman isn't going to become "good again". He was never good. That entire team is fucked and would probably lose to the Winnipeg Blue Bombers. I wouldn't be surprised if they resort to Tebow. The only reason Freeman is there is because Minnesota is one helluva a desperate and hopeless team. You don't start a guy that was unceremoniously drummed out of Tampa on the ugliest of notes because you are confident about the future.

He was way over his head against the Giants. I don't even want to see how he looks against Green Bay next weekend. The Vikes are so dysfunctional that if you happen to be an NCAA quarterback, you might want to consider blowing a couple of games against unranked opponents just to move down in the draft.

[Rush2112]

You start him if your last name is Fraiser and you're trying to keep your job as Head Coach.

Personally, I'd be giving Peterson the ball 30 times a game. He may be stacked up a few times but he's going to break one at least once a game.

As for Cassel, he's got more wins than the other two QBs on that team combined. He's not the long term answer, but at least let Freeman get past the playbook table of contents before you (over) throw him out there.

[Pruitt]

Drew Brees, Peyton Manning, Russell Wilson, Aaron Rodgers...

Just had to get those names into this thread - looking at Josh Freeman, Brady Quinn, Matt Cassell and Tyler Thigoen's names made me nauseous for a moment.

[BSF21]

Drew Brees, Peyton Manning, Russell Wilson, Aaron Rodgers...

Just had to get those names into this thread - looking at Josh Freeman, Brady Quinn, Matt Cassell and Tyler Thigoen's names made me nauseous for a moment.

Thanks for the shoutout buddy. I'll try and beat another undefeated team next week.

[Gunpowder]

Peterson had 13 carries for 28 yards. It's safe to say that they were not using him right, the line play was horrific, and the play calling was dismal. Freeman isn't going to become "good again". He was never good. That entire team is fucked and would probably lose to the Winnipeg Blue Bombers. I wouldn't be surprised if they resort to Tebow. The only reason Freeman is there is because Minnesota is one helluva a desperate and hopeless team. You don't start a guy that was unceremoniously drummed out of Tampa on the ugliest of notes because you are confident about the future.

He was way over his head against the Giants. I don't even want to see how he looks against Green Bay next weekend. The Vikes are so dysfunctional that if you happen to be an NCAA quarterback, you might want to consider blowing a couple of games against unranked opponents just to move down in the draft.

Freeman was very good in 2010, to the point where everybody thought he was going to be one of the top NFL QBs someday. Then he sucked before recovering somewhat last year (although they wanted to see a good 2013 before extending him and that never happened). He, like Ponder, has a problem with clunker games (nothing like Monday, that was another level of bad). Minnesota signed Freeman because Ponder isn't the answer, which I believe they've finally come around to accepting as fact.

There was no point in the Vikings NOT signing Freeman and seeing if he can return to his 2010 form away from Schiano's sinking ship in Tampa Bay. Schiano has alienated a great deal of his players so I don't know how much was Freeman's doing and how much to pin on Schiano, but while I'm not going to argue that he clearly wasn't ready to start (a lot of the players were roll out and have one short out and one deep out), I don't think you can just make all of these assumptions about the Vikings based on the simple signing of a guy who got run out of Tampa.

Also, I don't think I saw AP break a single tackle and he wasn't able to get anything outside. They should have kept giving it to him, especially after they got that fumble recovery and just needed a field goal to tie, but I think the cries that he was misused or ignored are a bit much. He wasn't doing much when he got the ball.

[Gunpowder]

You start him if your last name is Fraiser and you're trying to keep your job as Head Coach.

Personally, I'd be giving Peterson the ball 30 times a game. He may be stacked up a few times but he's going to break one at least once a game.

As for Cassel, he's got more wins than the other two QBs on that team combined. He's not the long term answer, but at least let Freeman get past the playbook table of contents before you (over) throw him out there.

Carson Palmer has more wins than all of them because QB wins are stupid.

I did agree with Gruden however (and I imagine you as well thought this, along with Scottie and anyone else who watched) that Freeman should have been replaced at halftime with either Ponder or Cassel.

[Rush2112]

Oh I know that wins are stupid individual stats in team sports, but in this case winning a game shows that you are at least competent. Ponder and Freeman (at this point) are anything but.

Freeman may give them the best chance of winning in the future but you can't throw the guy to the wolves like that.

[Gunpowder]

Oh I know that wins are stupid individual stats in team sports, but in this case winning a game shows that you are at least competent. Ponder and Freeman (at this point) are anything but.

Freeman may give them the best chance of winning in the future but you can't throw the guy to the wolves like that.

None of them played for the 2009 NE Patriots. I just can't give Cassel a huge leap up here because of that. He did one one winful year with the Chiefs, though, and yeah, he's better than Ponder. If Freeman doesn't get way better than he'll be their best option.

I think they should have realized at the half that they needed to get Freeman out of there. Maybe they thought he was ready enough, but he clearly wasn't.

[Keg]

Freeman concussed, Ponder in. According to the twitters.

[Rush2112]

None of them played for the 2009 NE Patriots.

Has nothing to do with his former Patriotness. I saw parts of the game against the Steelers and he looked competent, something the Ponder has not. I can't say anything about the other game that Cassell started as I didn't watch any of it.

My point is that Cassell should have been starting until Freeman was more comfortable with the playbook because, in my opinion, he gives them a better chance to win compared to Checkdown Christian and a QB that knows 2 plays in Freeman.

[Gunpowder]

I can understand giving him the start because you don't know until it happens that it's not going to work, but after halftime I think it was indefensible to not yank Freeman for one of the others.