nfl mvp race

[TT2.0]

admitted houston bias, & i know that a defensive player winning would be astronomical, but the only reason the texans have a defense at all is JJ Watt. 20.5 sacks, 3ff, 5recoveries, a pick 6, 3 recieving tds, a safety, god knows how many tipped passes and hurries, a blocked fg and oh by the way hes visibly held on every play. im sure manning or rodgers or brady wins, and there is a lot of people enamored with romo, but for my money JJ is the best player in the nfl. nobody in the league could come near replacing him. put brady in denver he puts up manning numbers. manning in green bay puts up rodgers numbers. nobody puts up JJ numbers and it has nothing to do with scheme. nobody in the history od the nfl has 2 20 sack seasons. not bruce smith, not LT, not deacon jones, nobody. he is literally redefining his position. but sure, lets not let him win because defenders arent mvps. consider this my preemptive bitching when he gets robbed.

[Pruitt]

I have no problem with Watt winning - saw him play four times this year and in every game, he was the dominant force.

But then, I have no problem with Rodgers, Brady, Roethlisberger, Romo or even Murray winning.

[wlu_lax6]

I have no problem with Watt winning - saw him play four times this year and in every game, he was the dominant force.

But then, I have no problem with Rodgers, Brady, Roethlisberger, Romo or even Murray winning.

Roethlisberger did not even win his team MVP vote

[A_B]

I have no problem with Watt winning - saw him play four times this year and in every game, he was the dominant force.

But then, I have no problem with Rodgers, Brady, Roethlisberger, Romo or even Murray winning.

Roethlisberger did not even win his team MVP vote

That's cause he's a fucking leader and told people not to vote for him. Man's man.

[Gunpowder]

While I don't think Brady or Manning would just go into Green Bay and be Rodgers because he's the mf-in' best mothafuckaaaaa, yeah I'd vote for Watt too. I probably penalize the QB position in MVP questions for carrying too much weight.

[Jerloma]

I don't think Manning and Brady should even be in the conversation. I'd be fine with Watt but if I were a voter and read your case, I wouldn't vote for him because you think the fact that he's had 2 20 sack seasons is relevant to him winning MVP this year. That's just digging. It's like you don't even believe it yourself at that point.

Plus, does anyone else find Watt's schtick to be a bunch of sanctimonious bullshit?

[boxcar]

I'd give it to Watt.

[A_B]

You don't give the MVP to Watt. He takes what he wants.

[Brontoburglar]

Yeah, but he didn't even have the most sacks in the NFL!

/pipinghottakethatisprobablyseriouslybeingsaidbysomeonesomewhere

[mister d]

Does Chris Ivory finish top 10?

[brian]

Unlike other sports, the idea of an MVP in football is kind of ridiculous to me personally. Never much cared about the individual awards in football.

[DC47]

Suh is Watt with one less consonant. More efficient. Plus, he leads the league in QB stomps. Finally, he's leading his team to the Superbowl. Watt's team can't beat the best Texan high school teams on a neutral field.

[Pruitt]

I don't think Manning and Brady should even be in the conversation. I'd be fine with Watt but if I were a voter and read your case, I wouldn't vote for him because you think the fact that he's had 2 20 sack seasons is relevant to him winning MVP this year. That's just digging. It's like you don't even believe it yourself at that point.

Plus, does anyone else find Watt's schtick to be a bunch of sanctimonious bullshit?

Schtick aside, and sacks aside, he is a worthy winner. He destroys offences.

And I get the sack comment - no one ever confused Michael Strahan for an MVP, but Watt is more than just a cut above him.

[Gunpowder]

Plus, does anyone else find Watt's schtick to be a bunch of sanctimonious bullshit?

Oh absolutely. Though he's still boss as fuck. We get it JJ, you work hard and take it seriously and no one else does. That's how you built yourself from a lowly 11th overall pick to true greatness.

[Jerloma]

It doesn't matter. If you're trying to make a case for MVP of this year and you're throwing in what he did in a year that's not this year, you're just trying to strengthen your case by adding non-applicable data. It destroys the integrity of your entire argument.

If I were trying to make a case for Ben being MVP, and I mentioned that he has two rings, I'd expect you to throw out my entire case. I'm basically admitting that I have a shit argument.

[EdRomero]

Agree with Brian about NFL MVP being meaningless, and I think Watts is an annoying self promoter. Anyway, I'd like to put in a vote for Gronk, even though it's impossible to compare him with QBs or the best defensive player in the universe. It's just amazing how much better the Patriots' offense is with a healthy Gronk, and I'm using this thread as an excuse to says he's wicked awesome.

[Gunpowder]

It doesn't matter. If you're trying to make a case for MVP of this year and you're throwing in what he did in a year that's not this year, you're just trying to strengthen your case by adding non-applicable data. It destroys the integrity of your entire argument.

If I were trying to make a case for Ben being MVP, and I mentioned that he has two rings, I'd expect you to throw out my entire case. I'm basically admitting that I have a shit argument.

You lose me when you use that to throw out the rest of a valid argument.

[Gunpowder]

Agree with Brian about NFL MVP being meaningless, and I think Watts is an annoying self promoter. Anyway, I'd like to put in a vote for Gronk, even though it's impossible to compare him with QBs or the best defensive player in the universe. It's just amazing how much better the Patriots' offense is with a healthy Gronk, and I'm using this thread as an excuse to says he's wicked awesome.

I could buy Gronk as well.

[sancarlos]

I think Watt was the BEST player. But I think Most VALUABLE player implies that your team accomplished something, and that this value led to the accomplishment. Like, making the playoffs.

[Jerloma]

It doesn't matter. If you're trying to make a case for MVP of this year and you're throwing in what he did in a year that's not this year, you're just trying to strengthen your case by adding non-applicable data. It destroys the integrity of your entire argument.

If I were trying to make a case for Ben being MVP, and I mentioned that he has two rings, I'd expect you to throw out my entire case. I'm basically admitting that I have a shit argument.

You lose me when you use that to throw out the rest of a valid argument.

Just to spite you for being dishonest.

[Gunpowder]

I haven't made the argument, and I agree with you, I just wouldn't immediately throw the whole thing out like I was a judge ruling on a technicality.

[Gunpowder]

I think Watt was the BEST player. But I think Most VALUABLE player implies that your team accomplished something, and that this value led to the accomplishment. Like, making the playoffs.

Is making the playoffs and not winning the Super Bowl that much more valuable then finishing 7th?

[Jerloma]

I haven't made the argument, and I agree with you, I just wouldn't immediately throw the whole thing out like I was a judge ruling on a technicality.

I wouldn't throw Watt out of the conversation; just Ben's case for him being MVP.

[TT2.0]

I think Watt was the BEST player. But I think Most VALUABLE player implies that your team accomplished something, and that this value led to the accomplishment. Like, making the playoffs.

so if the cleveland browns had beaten the ravens he would be a fine winner?

[EdRomero]

I think depending on the Cleveland Browns to win makes you automatically ineligible for any award.

[A_B]

I think depending on the Cleveland Browns to win makes you automatically ineligible for any award.

True story.

[joeyclams]

As a Packer fan, I think Rodgers has had a pretty remarkable year but even I think that Watt should probably win the MVP. There isn't a more dominate player in the league right now.

[Brontoburglar]

I don't think Manning and Brady should even be in the conversation. I'd be fine with Watt but if I were a voter and read your case, I wouldn't vote for him because you think the fact that he's had 2 20 sack seasons is relevant to him winning MVP this year. That's just digging. It's like you don't even believe it yourself at that point.

Plus, does anyone else find Watt's schtick to be a bunch of sanctimonious bullshit?

Schtick aside, and sacks aside, he is a worthy winner. He destroys offences.

And I get the sack comment - no one ever confused Michael Strahan for an MVP, but Watt is more than just a cut above him.

The sack comment has nothing to do with Michael Strahan and everything to do with Justin Houston, who had 22 sacks this year, 1.5 more than Watt.

[DC47]

It's hard for me to imagine a team's won-loss record being more impacted by the injury of a single player than that of Green Bay and New England. Watt may be better at his position, compared to other defensive linemen, than Rogers and Brady are at theirs. So too with Gronkowski.

But Rogers and Brady are going to have more impact simply because of the position they play. Would their teams be above .500 if they had gone on IR before the season started?

[mister d]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_New_E ... ots_season" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[DC47]

They turned out to have a pretty good back-up QB. I wouldn't count on that again. Though it is possible I'm discounting the Belichek factor as I've never followed a team with a good coach.

[Rush2112]

Also was 98% of the team that went undefeated the previous year, so evidently Brady was worth 6 wins.

[Tom 1860]

Anyone know the NFL's definition for the league MVP award? It seems to me that every year the media have kittens about this, but that none of them actually know what the award is for...

Is it the player who is:

1. The most valuable to his team and then ranked as more valuable to his team compared to the other 31 team MVP's?
2. The most dominant player, regardless of position over the past season?
3. The player without whom, his team would be most impacted by his loss?

Or something else...

If we are looking for the answer to question 2, then JJ Watt is the answer. Questions 1 & 3 have to be QBs in my opinion.

[Jerloma]

Also was 98% of the team that went undefeated the previous year, so evidently Brady was worth 6 wins.

Math...you suck at it.

[Rush2112]

Also was 98% of the team that went undefeated the previous year, so evidently Brady was worth 6 wins.

Math...you suck at it.

Sorry memory served they went 10-6 rather than 11-5.