San Bernadino

bfj · Post by **bfj** » Wed Dec 02, 2015 5:52 pm

Gunmen attack a large facility that services individuals with developmental disabilities. 14 dead and 14 injured. Gunmen still on the loose. I need a drink.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/02/us/san-be ... -shooting/

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Wed Dec 02, 2015 5:56 pm

From what I've been reading, it looks like the targets may have been county officials who were holding a holiday banquet on the premises.

Rex · Post by **Rex** » Wed Dec 02, 2015 9:04 pm

Gunpeople, bfj.

howard · Post by **howard** » Wed Dec 02, 2015 9:23 pm

FBI spokesman says terrorism is a possibility. They are still performing this evaluation:

Steve of phpBB · Post by **Steve of phpBB** » Wed Dec 02, 2015 10:15 pm

howard wrote:FBI spokesman says terrorism is a possibility. They are still performing this evaluation:

That's awesome.

Or terrible.

Rush2112 · Post by **Rush2112** » Wed Dec 02, 2015 10:59 pm

Steve of phpBB wrote:
howard wrote:FBI spokesman says terrorism is a possibility. They are still performing this evaluation:

That's awesome.

Or terrible.

I am by no means a Family Guy fan. I hate how they often run unfunny bits into the ground, etc. etc. But sometimes they have little pieces of brilliance.

Steve of phpBB · Post by **Steve of phpBB** » Wed Dec 02, 2015 11:06 pm

So apparently the guy is a Muslim named Syed Farook. Who was employed there and was apparently in a workplace dispute earlier.

So many questions ...

If it's a disgruntled employee shooting his bosses and coworkers, but the disgruntled employee is a Muslim, is it terrorism or just another guy going postal?

If the Muslim shoots up the place during a "Holiday party," is it part of the War on Christmas?

If they called it a Holiday party, is that part of the War on Christmas?

When was the last time it was an actual postal employee who went postal?

Post by **brian** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:00 am

If Planned Parenthood was to blame for the Colorado Springs shooting then obviously the developmentally disabled were to blame for this shooting.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:32 am

Tomorrow's headline:

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 6:15 am

@igorvolsky was widely lauded throughout my Twitter feed for reporting on the hypocrisy of the "thoughts and prayers" tweets of politicians who accepted NRA money. He retweeted "thoughts and prayers" tweets from the politicians' accounts with an added info of how much the NRA had donated to their campaigns.

rass · Post by **rass** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 7:20 am

Johnnie wrote:Tomorrow's headline:

<snip>

Damn. Daily News bringing the heat.

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 8:15 am

Steve of phpBB wrote:So apparently the guy is a Muslim named Syed Farook. Who was employed there and was apparently in a workplace dispute earlier.

So many questions ...

If it's a disgruntled employee shooting his bosses and coworkers, but the disgruntled employee is a Muslim, is it terrorism or just another guy going postal?

If the Muslim shoots up the place during a "Holiday party," is it part of the War on Christmas?

If they called it a Holiday party, is that part of the War on Christmas?

When was the last time it was an actual postal employee who went postal?

I never watch morning TV but I'm waiting for an oil change now and the Today Show is on in the lobby. Matt Lauer is certainly doing his best to push the "this must be terrorism" narrative.

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 8:25 am

I'm just salty the mass shootings thread never gets the bump. Guns inifinity always with the glory.

Ryan · Post by **Ryan** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 8:49 am

The only thing that stops a bad thread about guns is another equally bad thread about guns

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 8:51 am

Not going to post it here, but the NY Post cover today is particularly vile. They've decided to take a break from stoking hatred towards the poor and are doing their best to fuel Islamophobia and hatred of Muslims. Considering that there were already incidents in Texas, before this happened, of armed white gunmen standing outside of mosques and sharing lists of the home assesses of local Muslims, things could get really ugly here.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 9:01 am

Ryan wrote:The only thing that stops a bad thread about guns is another equally bad thread about guns

So what you are saying, if every Swamper started a thread about guns, there would be no bad threads about guns.

SportsDoc · Post by **SportsDoc** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 11:20 am

I think a ban on assault weapons and semi-automatic weapons is a reasonable compromise. Don't see how this would violate the 2nd Amendment. And, yes, I realize some criminals will get such weapons regardless of any ban. Still seems reasonable to me.

Of course I am an unusual Conservative. I've never owned a gun. I don't hunt, occasionally fish. I've never given a dime to the NRA, Ducks Unlimited or the like. I have had these conversations for 30 years with my friends who are hunters, some agree, some do not.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:30 pm

Onion reruns exact same headline.

Rush2112 · Post by **Rush2112** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:37 pm

Fox & Friends has a brilliant take on it all like they always do.

Steve of phpBB · Post by **Steve of phpBB** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:41 pm

SportsDoc wrote:I think a ban on assault weapons and semi-automatic weapons is a reasonable compromise. Don't see how this would violate the 2nd Amendment. And, yes, I realize some criminals will get such weapons regardless of any ban. Still seems reasonable to me.

Me, too.

But isn't most gun violence committed by handguns? I posted about this when the Oregon shooting happened, but two moms from my family's school were shot by one of the moms' ex-husband. It doesn't grab headlines, because instead of a dozen dead, it just resulted in one woman paralyzed forever and another with a bullethole where her eye used to be.

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:42 pm

SportsDoc wrote:I think a ban on assault weapons and semi-automatic weapons is a reasonable compromise. Don't see how this would violate the 2nd Amendment. And, yes, I realize some criminals will get such weapons regardless of any ban. Still seems reasonable to me.

Of course I am an unusual Conservative. I've never owned a gun. I don't hunt, occasionally fish. I've never given a dime to the NRA, Ducks Unlimited or the like. I have had these conversations for 30 years with my friends who are hunters, some agree, some do not.

It's only been in the last 15 years or so that the term "Conservative" has become so tainted by being associated with bible thumpers, gun nuts and those who would find the real Reagan to be far too left-wing as he believed that sometimes, politics involved compromise. The day Palin was announced as McCain's running mate was the day that things changed.

I may be wrong, and perhaps it's my own bias, but it seems to me that what is considered to be "Liberal" has not become more extreme over the same time span.

Post by **Sabo** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:44 pm

Steve of phpBB wrote:
SportsDoc wrote:I think a ban on assault weapons and semi-automatic weapons is a reasonable compromise. Don't see how this would violate the 2nd Amendment. And, yes, I realize some criminals will get such weapons regardless of any ban. Still seems reasonable to me.
Me, too.

But isn't most gun violence committed by handguns? I posted about this when the Oregon shooting happened, but two moms from my family's school were shot by one of the moms' ex-husband. It doesn't grab headlines, because instead of a dozen dead, it just resulted in one woman paralyzed forever and another with a bullethole where her eye used to be.

I saw something yesterday that stated 3 out of 4 incidents of gun violence involved a handgun.

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:51 pm

Rush2112 wrote:Fox & Friends has a brilliant take on it all like they always do.

Fuck these people are idiots.

Even though it could have been predicted, it is still appalling to see this.

My ultra-observant Rabbi friend (as religious a person as I have ever met) believes that God has a plan, that he is omnipotent. But he also believes that man has free will that can not be controlled by God. That man is weak and can be led into temptation that results in any of the four cardinal sins. He also believes that prayer is a very important part of a person's life, but what is more important are the deeds that a person does.

Basically, talk is cheap.

And no talk, no prayer, is cheaper than when it is used as a substitute for action.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:55 pm

I watched Fox News last night, they were 100% certain it was Terrrr-ists.

Question: are guns laws a state or federal law?

I know that California has one the strictest gun laws and Arizona the least strict. So it doesn't mean much when a person can go freely from one sate to another. Where does the 2nd Amendment come in?

Steve of phpBB · Post by **Steve of phpBB** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:16 pm

degenerasian wrote:I watched Fox News last night, they were 100% certain it was Terrrr-ists.

Question: are guns laws a state or federal law?

I know that California has one the strictest gun laws and Arizona the least strict. So it doesn't mean much when a person can go freely from one sate to another. Where does the 2nd Amendment come in?

All levels of government can regulate gun sales, possession, and ownership, but all such laws are subject to the Second Amendment. Most of the big Supreme Court cases involving restrictive gun laws have dealt with city ordinances, from places like Chicago, DC, etc.

howard · Post by **howard** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:22 pm

The Sybian wrote:
Ryan wrote:The only thing that stops a bad thread about guns is another equally bad thread about guns
So what you are saying, if every Swamper started a thread about guns, there would be no bad threads about guns.

It sure would improve manners around here.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 7:41 pm

Pruitt wrote:It's only been in the last 15 years or so that the term "Conservative" has become so tainted by being associated with bible thumpers, gun nuts and those who would find the real Reagan to be far too left-wing as he believed that sometimes, politics involved compromise.

No. My father was a local committee man for the Republican party in the 1970s, and he quit in the early 1980s, because he was disgusted that the moral majority types were taking over the party in our area. And, he is a religious guy, himself!

bfj · Post by **bfj** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 8:55 pm

I remember the Moral Majority. Wasn't that Falwell and his crew? Has to be 25+ years ago b

Rush2112 · Post by **Rush2112** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 10:57 pm

bfj wrote:I remember the Moral Majority. Wasn't that Falwell and his crew? Has to be 25+ years ago b

Yup. Founded 1979.

rass · Post by **rass** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:36 pm

So...apparently the landlord for the apartment where the suspects lived just let the media (and neighbors!) storm through the residence. Crazy...

Ryan · Post by **Ryan** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:49 pm

rass wrote:So...apparently the landlord for the apartment where the suspects lived just let the media (and neighbors!) storm through the residence. Crazy...

So crazy. So where's it raining in their bedroom?

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:50 pm

Joke is on the shooters - this is America - hard to terrorize us with a mass shooting - we do that all the time to ourselves.

howard · Post by **howard** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:52 pm

So fucking stupid. Should've charged admission, and negotiated a price for a tv news exclusive.

Ryan · Post by **Ryan** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:55 pm

howard wrote:So fucking stupid. Should've charged admission, and negotiated a price for a tv news exclusive.

Maybe they had some Al Capone memorabilia.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:55 pm

Firmly on the terrorist side of the scale and not so much mental illness/pissed off employee? Proof positive, as if there were a need, that this country is fucked up. So bad that we dont even know when weve been attacked by terrorists. Just run of the mill regular guys that ended a bad day at work with semiautomatic gunfire. You know those days.

rass · Post by **rass** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:22 pm

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:30 pm

HaulCitgo wrote:Firmly on the terrorist side of the scale and not so much mental illness/pissed off employee? Proof positive, as if there were a need, that this country is fucked up. So bad that we dont even know when weve been attacked by terrorists. Just run of the mill regular guys that ended a bad day at work with semiautomatic gunfire. You know those days.

Great point.

Just read that the landlord has been escorted away by the police.

So should whoever is supposed to be guarding the apartment.

Steve of phpBB · Post by **Steve of phpBB** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:31 pm

It's a little wacky, but I don't like seeing the lefty writers I follow on Twitter working themselves up over this.

We are talking about mass murderers, after all.

Brontoburglar · Post by **Brontoburglar** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:41 pm

The driver's license fallout is going to be fascinating

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 3:50 pm

I don't really know what lefty Twitter people are saying. I'm outraged because they are trampling an active scene in an incredibly important investigation. People are moving shit around, now fingerprints are on EVERYTHING. We don't know if others were involved with this or any host of other things the FBI is looking into.

The landlord is going to be charged with whatever the equivalent to hindering an investigation is, possibly obstructing justice, too.

And while it's probably not likely they will be charged... If reporters sat there and watched this guy tear down a police barricade and entered past police tape... That's knowingly entering a crime/investigation scene.

The other HUGE issue here is they are holding up pictures and a drivers license having NO IDEA who is being pictured. We've already had The Daily Best mis-identify the shooter earlier in the week, just like a bunch of outlets ran pictures of the woman they thought was killed in the Belgian raid of that terrorist, only to find out she had nothing to do with anything.

Fucking stupid.